Forum: Public Forum

Adam,

I shall print your message and leave it to the consideration of the others.

Some extra cash was strewn before the party last time to cover the restoration expenses. Only the 100gp version is needed, but you will require the services of an NPC Priest for that, or buy a scroll, or invest in a partially loaded wand of restoration, I mean the possibilities are many when the money is available.

In order for our game not to be sued by the JRR Tolkien Trust, it is advisable to use the term mithral and not mithril.

We shall do some retcon shopping for you next week, no worry.

Laurent,

Dear Players,

Latest game session

A bit of an average session last night, cannot win all the time I guess. The CR9 tag on the Dire Crocodile was a bit low. The plan was to offer a challenging encounter as a one-per-day format, i.e. fresh party and no reason to save spells for later. CR9 for an EL6 party is indeed challenging withour being impossible. CR12 for an EL5 party, as in the case for Xanesha, was meant to be impossible without a plan.

As it turned out, I had to keep the croc on a leash for the first two rounds for fear of killing, and digesting two PCs. My rolls were average, even low to some extent, and the party did not make any stupid mistake, carefully checking the AoO from the 15ft threat radius; still the beast was way above its CR.

The beast retreated at soon as it dropped below one third of its HP, with one meal in her stomach. I would have loved to have her retreat once below half but she had nothing to eat at that time! The bite, grapple, swallow then swim away scenario should have been expected. Doing that to the donkey would have been unfair to the owner and the party as a whole because of the loss of magical items stored on the poor thing.

The Ogrekin, Rukus I think, and his hounds were otherwise a cakewalk. Again, I have to let you play with your bow and arrows at times, so it was only fair to give you a round for that. The party is now at the farm, just behind a corn field and has no reason to stop for a night (Wizard, Sorcerer) and a day (the Priest gets his spell at night) to spell up; in fact it cannot since it now knows of at least one Black Arrow Ranger being kept prisoner. So in a way it may have cost the GM an Ogrekin and five hounds, but you spent at least a haste spell. You have a lot of resources, but the casters should learn that they do not have to cast every round. The Graul farm is going to be a tall order to do in one go (one game day but many game sessions) and should eat in the party's healing reserves (I assume you have a lot of wands and scrolls).

Since I expect seven players next week, the scale-up rules will apply again (I had dropped them when we were running at four to five players after Marie having left).

• double the amount of gribblies (support troops like Goblins, Hounds, Hobgoboes, Skellies, etc).
• 150% to 200% HP for named NPCs.
• 150% HP for ecounter specific monsters, but still generic as "from the Pathfinder Bestiary".

All these rules apply when appropriate and according to room size in a dungeon obviously. The XP gain is commensurate to the HP increase, I need to dish out more XP too to compensate for an adventure sized for four PCs.

Event registration
Could you please add your name on the calendar event corresponding to "Rise of the Runelords" July 21st. I mean the calendar "page" you get when clicking on the calendar event and not the game page itself.

Calendar event page:
It has the cover of "Rise of the RuneLords" player's guide.
This is a short description, or vignette, for the event.
It has an "add me to the list of participants" box. You should see Laurent and Len2 (a test profile from the administrator with only basic member privileges).

If you have any trouble with that, please go to the debug thread, read the entries pertaining to our peculiar issue (the add me box not being seen) and drop requests for help there if need be.

Rise of the Runelords game page:
This page displays the cover of the current adventure and provides more information about the game such as its history and links to the discussion thread.

This is a change from the Meetup.com format as our new calendar has automatic hovering pop-up display when one leaves the mouse pointer on an event. Thus the event should not spill all over the page, hence the vignette idea to link to a bigger and more complete page.

Laurent,

I forgot to say that I shall keep posting the game event on the Meetup.com site until we close our account there, but everything on Meetup.com points back here.

Hopefully the player list thingy will be solved soon, this is very likely a cookie/browser permission issue not a website issue. Even if you cannot register on the event page, drop a message in this thread to confirm your availability. Make sure you "watch" (click on the little eye) this thread so that you get an email message when someone posts on it.

Laurent,

Dear Players,

Event registration problems
Have a look at the thread, there you shall see that the problem has now been solved. This was due to corrupted permission information associated with the page: I was able to see and play with the "add me to the list" box thanks to my "Admin Team Member" credentials. When I asked Len to have a look at it, he also saw it since he has even higher credentials. Then I told him to try a basic member profile, and he found out that like you he could not see the box. This issue has now been solved, so please add your name to the list for the game on Wednesday July 21st.

Full complement
Ian (username ian_t) will join us on Wednesday. When he asked what to play, I said "Anything you want really" as the arcane and divine sides are covered. The combat is also covered with frontline melee (Paladin) and flankers (Thief and Ranger). A Barbarian was hinted at, but I mentioned Bard or Druid... as Eigan the Ranger is not really obsessed by the beauty of Mother Nature.
I have therefore closed the game to new players. The party will now have seven PCs and I shall expect a weekly average of five to six players with seven on the roster, hence the game is more or less assured to run every week.

Ian already plays a Dwarven Cleric in Nick's Pathfinder "Kingmaker" game, in which I play a hard-to-hit Halfling Abjurer, so he is no newbie.

Laurent,

I shell bi uxtra corefal nit ti onfrunge capywrught frim naw in.

Tu bi en tha sufa soda A wall rifur ti ot us i mothrel short.

In other news, thanks for not feeding Marcus to the crocodile... unless he was that one meal.... And great to have Ian joining us. I think we could do with another character who's fighty and stabby....

Dear players,

Another player is joining us tonight, Ian (ian_t). Ian plays in Nick's "Kingmaker" so is known by most of the gaming group. You will find his Fighter PC lurking around the Graul's farmstead.

After thinking about it, this new recruit will have a Sihedron rune tatoo on his forearm, proving that he used to be a gambler on "Paradise", which is the name of the barge that sank for those with short memory.

Killing him on sight because of this tatoo would be an EL6 encounter, bringing you a crap load of gp and spare equipment. Careful though for the lightly armoured members, an LV6 Pathfinder RPG Fighter can pack some punch.

Tonight Ogrekins will be tougher than last week's sample.
You already know the weird logic of D&D: The more numerous a party is, the more difficult a task becomes!

Normal meeting time of half past six and start when the shop closes at 7.00 p.m.

Laurent,

Dear players,

Well, it is not every encounter that I hand over 25K+ in XP in one big lump!

[The fight]

The battle was epic, I chose not to pull any punches with my Ogrekins, then again, considering their D20 rolls they were already sufficiently emasculated as it was. The "brothers" reacted logically, eagerness to swat some human flies on their own at the start, then calling for reinforcements.
When the other three brothers came in, I thought the party was toast. All I needed was for one of them to get two rounds of successful hits on the split party (two members where three rounds away from the others at one time).

The trapped homestead was the surprise, it had to be, and my "secret" roll for Marcus' "spot trap all the time" ability was indeed a failure.

Good point about the choice of starting with the house and not the barn though... It makes for a livelier adventure.
I have obviously upgraded the encounter, changed the map, gave the farm an additional barn, kennel and more fields on the side.

The spread did not call for all the fields to be use as tactical terrain, but you used at least once, which was good enough to make the combat more memorable.

It is pretty obvious that the first encounter should have involved STEALTH, I had expected the party to spot the new member, make contact, recruit him and decide upon a sneaksie plan... well, since the Gnome decided to shout, Crawfood and Pumpkin had no real choice but start the two hours encounter (yep, that long, we started the farm proper around twenty past nine).

[Goodie-two-shoes... or not]
Hexagalamere, the "child killer" Paladin should bound pretty well with the party after all. They are known, especially Elswyn, for murdering a poor guy suffering from Ghoul fever, while said innocent was confined in a straightjacket. Add to that the gruesome murder of commoners strapped to crosses and made to look like scarecrows in cornfields (near Sandpoint), and Hexagalamere should feel at home with that bunch of murderous scumbags also known as "The Dirty Half-Dozen".

Hexagalamere killed "Lucky" and "Maulgro", the two sons of Mammy Graul, they were also the sons and brothers of the rest of the Grauls.
Lucky was the one who looked most human, he was despised by Mammy Graul, hence his soiled and hardly ever changed clothes.
Maulgro was loved by Mammy because of the stumps he had for legs. She enjoyed watching the wretched creature crawl and fall every time he tried to dance.

[Next week]
Onwards to talk to Mammy Graul!

[Update]
The event is up for next week.
I have updated the Rise of the Runelords game page.

Laurent,

Ian,

Just a few things before the next game, First thanks for a great first game session and sorry about the slight rules lawyer-ing I did with the attacks of opportunity against one of groups magic users, did not want to see him go squish Vs one of the ogre kin.

No worry about that, when the party was low-level, they used to have a Gnomish Sorcerer whose role was to summon an Eagle to fly into the threat range of a creature just for the monster to spend his AoO.
Now that they are at level 6, Marcus the Thief plays the role of the Eagle thanks to his annoyingly high AC when avoiding AoO. Marcus has taken the mobility feat.

1. What are my uncle's name and the town? Sorry forgot it.

Your uncle is Maelin Shreed LG male human Cleric of Erastil 6.
The town is "Turtleback Ferry", LN, population 430, 91% human.
Typical D&D medieval fantasy frontier town.
Local industry: fish.

2. Do I get on with him?

He is a nice guy, but unlikely to get involved in anything big. He sent a request to Magnimar for some support with regards to the absence of Ranger patrols of late.
He did not like having "Paradise" moored in town and has an "I told you so" attitude towards people who have lost close ones to the disaster.
He advised you against looking for trouble by spying on the Grauls on your own. The Ogrekins had been cowed years ago and a tacit understanding between them and Turtleback Ferry developed: "Don't poke them and they wont eat your children".

You went gambling a bit at "Paradise" then realised that something was wrong, you won a bit too easily. Smelling a rat, you took your gains and never gambled there again. A wise choice as less than a week after you decided to stop gambling, the barge caught fire and sank with eighteen dead.
Your uncle disapproved of your gambling.

''3. Which side of the family is he one for me?
Your choice.''

4. Did he send me to investigate the rangers' disappearance or is that of my own initiative?

Your own initiative, you will prove him wrong when you free the rangers. There is nothing evil about your uncle, Erastil is a god of nature and tend towards "balance".

5. If it's my own initiative why am I doing it? Was one a good friend? Do I have a vested interest in getting them back?

You could be a good friend of one of the rangers, whom you expected to be on the missing patrol:

Vale Temros would be your best mate. His parents were Black Arrows, they got killed by the Grauls years ago. He has a knack for siege tactics, in game terms some ranks in Knowkedge (architecture and engineering).
Kaven Windstrike is another Black Arrow you know of, he is a f***ing twat and a coward. He may have been romantically involved with Lady Lucrecia. Then again, you enjoy hearing disparaging rumours about him. He always volunteers for the Turtleback Ferry patrol route - the safest.
You do not know the name of the third Ranger, the one with the Black Bear animal companion the party rescued earlier on (the bear not the ranger).

6. Since I am a fighter am I part of the town guard/ militia? If so what rank am I?

You could be in the militia, then again, the town is pretty small and depends on Fort Rannick for protection. Your character should not have any responsibility like constable or sheriff though as he will need to stick with the party.

7. What's my reputation in the town and the town folk there? Is joining the group good for me to get away from there or will I see it as a way to do greater good?

You crave for adventure, Turtleback Ferry is a bit boring. Unless you want to have more flavour for your PC, I cannot see any reason for him to have a specific background.

Sorry about all the questions. See you Wednesday for the next session.

As a GM I do not really care for elaborate background.
For me, role-playing is usually limited to the current action in the game, Paizo's adventures tend to have a good mix of interaction/combat.

See you on Wednesday.

Laurent,

Dear players,

The game page has been updated.
The calendar event is up for next week.

Owen, Alex

Your characters have been played according to the rule "Character sheets with GM, PC played and XP collected".
Nobody died, well Marcus visited the -4 territory, but nothing critical.

Game

Nearly done with the Grauls, you have not found their treasure yet! I must reassure you now, you have been through the worst and the vilest of the adventure. No more female aborted foetus, no more ranger to be forced Pulp Fiction style to perform sexual prowess, just plain Ogres from now on: Brutish, heavy handed, tough but monstrous only because they count as monsters.

As mentioned you will have one week in Turtleback Ferry, good for scribing scrolls, recovering from HP loss and deciding what equipment to sell. Hint: the party carries a lot of crap that could have been useful five levels ago but now would still cost one in-game action to use for minimal to no effect.

Sell your wands at half-price for a charge pro-rata. Stop lugging around hundreds of arrows, masterwork weapons you are unlikely to magic up, extraneous amulets, unused +1 weapons and other tat. I am thinking of applying the carrying capacity and other "common sense" encumbrance rules. Buy saddle bags for your horseys and ponies and lighten-up your character.

Pathfinder/Golarion books

In order to support our FLGS I will try to set up a list of books that would prove interesting for you the players to read.
Golarion is a pretty decent setting, for those familiar with Greyhawk, it has the same taste and has been built learning from the mistakes made with the aforementioned legendary setting.
Paizo is now developing a line of fiction set in Golarion, i.e. they are doing a Forgotten Realms with their world.

To add to your enjoyment of the game, it would be good if you knew your Varisia from your Cheliax, your Desna from your Asmodeus and other racial background for Dwarves, Gnomes, etc.

Of course the game can still be played as it is currently as Rise of the Runelords is pretty much Varisia centric and self-contained to an extent.

Thread

Please keep the thread alive by discussing stuff.

Laurent,

Glad to hear Hexagalamere is still alive and kicking - I guess we tangled with the big mama and came out OK. So it's on to the fort now I guess? (I sudder to think what condition the rangers where if by the above description of events)

I'll echo Laurent's endorsement of the world, it is very interesting reading and I have got a number of the background books just to learn more more about it. In some ways it is a shame that the adventure paths are so contained (even though they are great adventures) as you never really get a chance to see the rest of the world.

Looking forward to the next session

Owen

Hello,

I can see only three players signed in so far. Well, one more is always there of course, so we have a game, but what about the others?

Nick (Harper), Adam and Alex?

Laurent,

Apologies.. kinda a bit out of things at the moment.. change of website and being an Uncle (of an 10 day old nephew)...
Have signed up for Tomorrow.. I know of no reason I shouldn't be there.
If I do not say either way on here .. please assume that I'll be there unless I email you (Laurent) /post on here to advise I cannot attend.

Dear Players,

Well, after a quick lash of the whip calling for registration, we now have a full house for tonight's game.

The whiplash is figurative of course, I do not want my game to sink to some unsettling levels of sexual fantasy.

I shall henceforth endeavour to deliver light entertainment suitable for family audience and God fearing Christians. I promise no more Hobgobo having it with a female Goblin, no more Ogrekin incestuous smutfest, the game shall now be back to 1950s standards of decency.

Laurent,

i'm back!!!! taken bloody long enough I know, but finally fixed everything!!! YAY!!!

to the Games-mobile.

Dear players,

The game page has been updated.
The calendar event is up for next week.

The Hook Mountains Adventure Park.

Are you in a band of mid-level heroes bored to kill rats for measly excepee in the cellar of the local "Welcoming Wench Inn"? Has the thought of putting Zombies risen from the village's graveyard out of their misery lost its appeal? Do you yawn when you hear the average unnamed NPC peasant commoner calling for adventurers to kill Goblins lairing in "...thar yonder Black Hills" to retrieve some crappy piece of jewelry not worth enough to buy you a flask of Alchemist Fire?

If you can say yes to any of these, please come to visit the Hook Mountain adventure park.
You will find masochistic Ogres ready to be sliced and diced for your amusement, play the banjo to ambush them, they will gladly offer their kidney for sneak-attack. No sweat, no fear, no danger, just guaranteed killing of good old Ogres as big wandering and easy to hit HP bags!

No seriously, I wonder why I bother even selecting monsters nowadays, where is the fun in doubling some base HP total then reaching zero by substracting the same HP in less than four rounds barely dishing out one hit in ten attacks from statistically half decent monsters?

I should bring back the GM screen and go back to "Does a 73 followed by a 68 hit you?"
Last encounter:

• Eight basic Ogres with a half decent +8 to attack.
• One Ogre Barbarian with an attack sequence of +18/+13

And still I only managed to drop Eigan!

Fort Rannick.

As mentioned to these players who are part of the furniture at "Vague Connections", there is no real timer to go against. There were no prisoners, and if they had been, they would have been eaten by now.
However, I would expect the party to set themselves a challenge of retaking the fort within two days.
If you take more than three, I will set-up the next event in the adventure, for which you will be likely out of spells. You are a big party, with a lot of spellcasting resources, so I guess it is possible for you to reclaim Fort Rannick pretty quickly. Remember though that those Lightning Bolts could be more efficient on mini-bosses than the CR3 Ogre rank and file.

See you on Wednesday,

Laurent,

right-o

Having read through various 3.5 and Pathfinder articles I have worked out the issues raised.

1. Spring Attack cancels reach against one target.
2. You must move 10ft, IN A STRAIGHT LINE first.
3. You do not have to use the movement to move away, however but the inital attack must be from the angle charged.
4. You may then use the remainder of your movement to go anywhere. You still provoke AOO but not against the target that you struck

Andrew,

Just a few things to expand on your four point interpretation:

First "All we want are the facts, ma'am" (Dragnet, 1951)

Pathfinder Reference Document

Spring Attack (Combat)

You can deftly move up to a foe, strike, and withdraw before he can react.

Prerequisites: Dex 13, Dodge, Mobility, base attack bonus +4.

Benefit: You can move up to your speed and make a single melee attack without provoking any attacks of opportunity from the target of your attack. You can move both before and after the attack, but you must move at least 10 feet before the attack and the total distance that you move cannot be greater than your speed. You cannot use this ability to attack a foe that is adjacent to you at the start of your turn.

Normal: You cannot move before and after an attack.

System Reference Document 3.5

SPRING ATTACK [GENERAL]

Prerequisites: Dex 13, Dodge, Mobility, base attack bonus +4.

Benefit: When using the attack action with a melee weapon, you can move both before and after the attack, provided that your total distance moved is not greater than your speed. Moving in this way does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender you attack, though it might provoke attacks of opportunity from other creatures, if appropriate. You can’t use this feat if you are wearing heavy armor.

You must move at least 5 feet both before and after you make your attack in order to utilize the benefits of Spring Attack.

Special: A fighter may select Spring Attack as one of his fighter bonus feats.

I would have sworn that the 3.5 version mentioned something about actually springing then retreating, but I was wrong.
Note the way the PRD now actually restricts the movement phases of the spring attack: ten feet movement and non-adjacent foe.
Therefore the ride by attack like movement for a spring attack is technically legal, as long as the initial ten feet movement takes place.

Your interpretation

1. Spring Attack cancels reach against one target.

In a way yes, in fact it effectively cancels the threatened area of THE target with regards to the PC attacking with Spring Attack. One has to use Spring Attack though, so no casting safely while moving by saying "Hey, I have Spring Attack!"

2. You must move 10ft, IN A STRAIGHT LINE first.

10ft: yes, straight line: no.
The attacker can dance about the target as long as the distance moved prior to the attempted hit is at least ten feet.

3. You do not have to use the movement to move away, however but the inital attack must be from the angle charged.

There is no charge, but I agree with the fact that the movement surprisingly need not be spring-like, as far as the rules state it anyway.

4. You may then use the remainder of your movement to go anywhere. You still provoke AOO but not against the target that you struck

Yep, if other creatures threaten any square that the attacker leaves during the procedure, they can whack the attacker. Mobility, which is a pre-requisite for Spring Attack, still applies in this particular case of having more than one opponent.

Laurent,

hi guys just posted this on the pazio web site to see what others thought.

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderRPG/rules/springAttackFeat&page=1#0

Laurent's interpretation looks the same as mine, I think. I've done a bit of searching, and all I can find online is a discussion on the paizo site without any 'official' input.

As I see it, there are two main uses for sneak attack.

1. The 'Final Fantasy' attack - move in, strike once, move out, without provoking attack of opportunity from the target.

2. The 'dart round the back'. When a target has been attacked by an ally from the front, using spring attack to move around the target through squares threatened by the target to get to a flanking position at the back for a sneak attack. This uses the "no AoO for target" not just to avoid AoO from reach (if any) and AoO from moving away, but AoO from moving *within* through the target's threatened squares. Sometimes, depending on starting position and space, it's possible to get round the back without entering a threatened square, but Spring Attack makes a short cut through threatened squares possible - or at least it might.

Restrictions:
No moving more than move allowance
Must move at least 10ft
Can't use it on a target that's adjacent at the start of turn

Not restricted (in Pathfinder):
No requirement to move in a straight line (as in charging)
No requirement to move after the attack
Nothing explicit prohibiting moving from one threatened square to another around the target.

As for reality, well, I don't think Spring Attack is intended to be a lunge. It's dancing, weaving, and feinting, followed by a sudden spring. Straight line attacks (based on my fencing experience) are easiest to defend - opponents messing around with distance and angles are much trickier opponents.